Negro Leagues

[Evan43]

Is there a way to create players into the database; to add the old school negro league all-stars. I would like to have Judy Johnson and Cool Papa Bell show up to draft. Is it easy to do or would I mess up my game? Maybe this is a feature for next years game.

[Gaedel]

You can create then yourself if you so wish. The problem with creating them is that the stats of the negro leagues are so incomplete and so jumbled that our evaluation of those players is primarily based on "reputation" and on people that "saw them play". If Clay and ian tried to create them, they would just be guessing and, I would think, would rather leave the guessing up to you.

[Evan43]

I am sure there is a forum about how to create them myself. Could some tell me how or link me to the forum.

[MrMackie]

Speaking of which, I'm planning on playing a league starting in the 1920s that features early integration. Though many of the great Negro League stars played later, I'm going to hand-pick several of the more notable players and place them on various historical teams. Basically, I want Josh Gibson (and others) to play against Babe and the Yankees in the 20s and 30s.

Of course, I'm going to do my best to accurately assign ratings and all that (e.g., Josh Gibson would have a power rating of ~95+, Satchel Paige's peak would be from age 30 to age 50 with a slow decline :)). I have a list of over a dozen Negro League stars I'm going to do this for.

[HoustonGM]

I am sure there is a forum about how to create them myself. Could some tell me how or link me to the forum.
http://www.sportsmogul.com/baseball2k7/rosters.htm

that...or you can copy an existing player in the player editor and edit his stats.

[Evan43]

Thanks for the help. I'll see what I can do. I still think it would be a nice feature for next year's game. It could be optional in usage. A check box, maybe, 'use or don't use' negro league all-stars. Just an idea.

[Jeff Olsen]

If Clay and ian tried to create them, they would just be guessing and, I would think, would rather leave the guessing up to you.They could just take the stats from Oldtime Baseball.

[Gaedel]

They could just take the stats from Oldtime Baseball.

Were those stats based on any kind of reality?? The Negro League Committee of the Society for Amercain Baseball Resarch (SABR) combed newspapers and hunted up score card collectors for years. In 1994, they publsihed probably the best stats book "The Negro Leagues Book" ever published. The records are spotty (and obviously incomplete). According to the records they could produce, Satchel Paige never had more than 154 IP per season.

Anybody can make up what they want to make up, but they are just guessing. In most of the leagues, the teams might play 60 or 70 games against league competition, then barnstorm against semi-pro and factory teams. Because of this, legends as to numbers of homeruns hit or strikeouts are just that, legends. 19th century baseball has a better and more reliable records cache.

[chrisfx]

Speaking of which, I'm planning on playing a league starting in the 1920s that features early integration. Though many of the great Negro League stars played later, I'm going to hand-pick several of the more notable players and place them on various historical teams. Basically, I want Josh Gibson (and others) to play against Babe and the Yankees in the 20s and 30s.

Of course, I'm going to do my best to accurately assign ratings and all that (e.g., Josh Gibson would have a power rating of ~95+, Satchel Paige's peak would be from age 30 to age 50 with a slow decline :)). I have a list of over a dozen Negro League stars I'm going to do this for.
Exact.. Paige is already in the game during his later years, but he is relegated to a mediocre relief role if I remember correctly. I've planned on creating an All-Negro league team, just havnt gotten around to it.

[TheNamelessPoet]

Speaking of which, I'm planning on playing a league starting in the 1920s that features early integration. Though many of the great Negro League stars played later, I'm going to hand-pick several of the more notable players and place them on various historical teams. Basically, I want Josh Gibson (and others) to play against Babe and the Yankees in the 20s and 30s.

Of course, I'm going to do my best to accurately assign ratings and all that (e.g., Josh Gibson would have a power rating of ~95+, Satchel Paige's peak would be from age 30 to age 50 with a slow decline :)). I have a list of over a dozen Negro League stars I'm going to do this for.

Keep me up to date on that... Im currious about guys like paige and gibson and how they would have done agains the majors. I have a feeling some would have DOMINATED if integration would have been in like 1850.

[robinhoodnik]

Keep me up to date on that... Im currious about guys like paige and gibson and how they would have done agains the majors. I have a feeling some would have DOMINATED if integration would have been in like 1850.
There was integration. It began in the later 1800's but started falling back into the "race line" around the late 1880's to the 1890's. Contrary to what most of us are taught in school it was northern interests that began shoving black players back out of "organized baseball".

Josh Gibson is credited with the longest homerun ever hit OUT of Yankee Stadium (not in). Reports vary though, some say it left the park in the air all the way, others claim it hit the top of the outer stadium fence. He's also credited with a .380 average in 1932, .393 average in 1942 and also was supposed to have hit 79 and 85 homeruns in single seasons. He's said to have hit balls that were up to 580 feet away from the point of impact.
A good reference to his skills though comes from none other than Walter Johnson: "There is a catcher that any big league club would like to buy for $200,000 ( A LOT of money then)... He hits the ball a mile. And he catches so easy he might as well be in a rocking chair. Throws like a rifle. Bill Dickey isn't as good a catcher. Too bad this Gibson is a colored fellow."

[robinhoodnik]

I would love to be able to add Negro League players into BBM. Who wouldn't want Judy Johnson, Satch, Sol White, Andrew "Rube" Foster, or Raleigh "Biz" Mackie on their team?
Did you know that the Red Sox could have had both Jackie Robinson and Willie Mays in Boston but wouldn't do it because of their skin color? They both played in the same area as the Red Sox spring training took place and the Sox were aware of their talent, but more aware of their heritage.

[robinhoodnik]

Were those stats based on any kind of reality?? The Negro League Committee of the Society for Amercain Baseball Resarch (SABR) combed newspapers and hunted up score card collectors for years. In 1994, they publsihed probably the best stats book "The Negro Leagues Book" ever published. The records are spotty (and obviously incomplete). According to the records they could produce, Satchel Paige never had more than 154 IP per season.

Anybody can make up what they want to make up, but they are just guessing. In most of the leagues, the teams might play 60 or 70 games against league competition, then barnstorm against semi-pro and factory teams. Because of this, legends as to numbers of homeruns hit or strikeouts are just that, legends. 19th century baseball has a better and more reliable records cache.
Absolutely true. Often Mexican, Cuban, and other leagues are included in the totals for players. They played anyone and everyone. Some star teams even played in tuxedo's for a few extra dollars. You often read that players skipped from team to team, league to league, during a season. Some premier teams stuck together for awhile and are more reliable stats wise since they made their reputation on how good they really were but many players reps are just that. Reputations; without much historical data.

[Jeff Olsen]

Were those stats based on any kind of reality??They only included enough players for one team, maybe two. I'm guessing those players had the most verifiable stats.

[Gaedel]

They only included enough players for one team, maybe two. I'm guessing those players had the most verifiable stats.

I would guess that they were the most recognizable players and stats were generated for them.

Satchel Paiges "best" Negro league numbers according to reconstructed stats is a follows:

1932 Pittsburgh EWL
G-29
IP-181
W-14
L-8
H-92
R-77
ER-Unknown
BB-13
K-109
ERA-Cannot compute

[Gaedel]

Paige's best recorded year overall was in the 1939-1940 Puerto Rican Winter League with Guayama:

G-24
IP-205
W-19
L-3
H-Unk
R-Unk
ER-44
BB-54
K-208
ERA-1.93