OBA calculating differently? [Fixed 9.44B]

[HoustonGM]

View the screen shot - three different players, all the same stats, three different OBA's...

[SirKodiak]

SAC = sacrifice fly or sacrifice hit (bunt)?
I am wondering, because:

On Base Percentage (OBP)
Divide the total number of hits, bases on balls and times hit by pitch by the total of at-bats, bases on balls, times hit by pitch and sacrifice flies.
and if SAC is sacrifice hits, then sacrifices flies is an unknown quantity. I think his OBA is .3777 (I closed the calculator before writing it down) if SAC is not included and 0 is used for sac flies.

[Solitaire]

Yeah, what Kodiak said. There are certain stats that aren't in there that are counted in OBA. Strikeout safe on first, reached on error, fielder's choice... Things like that.

[SirKodiak]

Yeah, what Kodiak said. There are certain stats that aren't in there that are counted in OBA. Strikeout safe on first, reached on error, fielder's choice... Things like that.
Safe on an error actually hurts your OBA, as for OBA, it is just an at bat. Same with fielder's choice. And I think the 'strikeout, safe on first' is the same, as I think it is scored a PB, WP, or E.

[ohms_law]

since this is from the editor and not a stats line, I would say that it's most likely a bug in the way that ratings are converted to predicted stats.

Good eye Houston!
;)

ps.: it was lower each time after changing the stats to what is displayed, correct?
That would be my guess, since a pointer/memory address error could cause that sort of problem (I think).

[SirKodiak]

since this is from the editor and not a stats line, I would say that it's most likely a bug in the way that ratings are converted to predicted stats.

Good eye Houston!
;)

ps.: it was lower each time after changing the stats to what is displayed, correct?
I have not played around with the editor, which of the sacrifices is SAC? Is there another place that sacrifice flies are entered?

[ohms_law]

My guess is that SAC is sacrifice hits. regardless, it doesn't really matter since the numbers that you enter are used by an algoritum to generate all the ratings. Those stats are just there for quick reference so that the person editing the player has a feel for what their actually entering. It's not recorded or used anywhere else that I can see.

[SirKodiak]

Never mind, I loaded up Mogul and checked, they are Sacrifice Hits (bunts), which have no effect on OBP. But sac flies, which are not shown, do have an effect on OBP. I do not see sac flies recorded anywhere, so it is possible that it is not a bug, but just a different number of sac flies.

[ohms_law]

I don't think that those stats are real though... there not based on anything except the stats entered into the text boxes. I'm pretty sure about that, anyway.

[Solitaire]

Safe on an error actually hurts your OBA, as for OBA, it is just an at bat. Same with fielder's choice. And I think the 'strikeout, safe on first' is the same, as I think it is scored a PB, WP, or E.

ROE and FC are 0/1 for both batting average and OBA. Strikeout safe on first is recorded as a K and WP or PB. It's 0/1 for BA and probably for OBA.

In my first post, I said they were counted in the OBA formula. That's true. I never said they affect it positively. :p

[HoustonGM]

The stats are predicted, and thus, it shouldn't take into account sacrifice flies, unless sac flies are also added into the player editor.

I noticed this when I was editting players for my scott hatteberg experiment (see general questions).

Woah now. Hold up.

Ok....see screenshot below. These players are ALL exactly the same...now I see why OBA is calculating seperately though. The Plate Appearances are different...however, there's absolutely nothing differnet in their predicted stats.

Now, I just completely wiped out Chad Tracy's predicted stats, and it's still listing him as having 5 plate appeareances...so maybe it's possible that players have predicted sac flies, but there's no way to edit them? The second screenshot shows this anomaly.

[ohms_law]

ah, so there is some leftover data. bummer.
different PA's would require different numbers of hits, walks, HBP, etc... wouldn't it?

I don't think that it really makes a difference though. the OBA that's listed there (along with the AVG and SLG) isn't real, it's just there so taht you have a ready reference to compare to.

[HoustonGM]

ah, so there is some leftover data. bummer.
different PA's would require different numbers of hits, walks, HBP, etc... wouldn't it?
That's why there's a bug. If you look at Chad Tracy, he has 0 stats for everything, yet still is listed as having 5 predicted PA's.


I don't think that it really makes a difference though. the OBA that's listed there (along with the AVG and SLG) isn't real, it's just there so taht you have a ready reference to compare to.
Nothing big, just thought I'd mention it.

[ohms_law]

Nothing big, just thought I'd mention it.
like I said earlier, good catch!
it is just a detail thing. it should get some attention eventually...

[SirKodiak]

That's why there's a bug. If you look at Chad Tracy, he has 0 stats for everything, yet still is listed as having 5 predicted PA's.


Nothing big, just thought I'd mention it.
I edited Chad Tracy, zeroed all the stats, then gave him 2 AB and 1 H. Results AVG .500, SLG .500, OBP .125. He still has 6 SF since I couldn't zero them, so OBP is 1/(2+6) or .125 as it should be. The problem is that you can't edit SF.

Attached is Player Stats after I edited Tracy's stats.

EDIT: I did same thing with perdicted stats, but OBP is .143, which is 1/7, so the game must be perdicting 5 SF for him.

[ohms_law]

so wait a minute. we're asking for sac fly's to be added to predicted stats then?
but then, I still don't think that it's used for anything beyond that screen, and the ratings are being set correctly... so, shold anything at all be done about this?

I'm not arguing the bug or anything like that, just wondering if this actually affects anything at all.

[HoustonGM]

so wait a minute. we're asking for sac fly's to be added to predicted stats then?
As SirKodiak proved, the game has at leat a "hidden" predicted sac fly number. Since this exists, we should be allowed to edit it...or...it should be removed.


but then, I still don't think that it's used for anything beyond that screen, and the ratings are being set correctly... so, shold anything at all be done about this?
Well, I'm sure it's used to calculate the "Sacrifice Fly" skill on the skills page...

[Clay Dreslough]

I do not see sac flies recorded anywhere, so it is possible that it is not a bug, but just a different number of sac flies.This is what's going on. I've fixed it by adding Sacrifice Flies (SF) to the Player Editor.

Clay

[HoustonGM]

Thanks Clay.