11.17 Premature player retirement

[Waldo2186]

Three games into the 2008 season, at the young age of 28 and starting the season as the Marlins starting 2b, Dan Uggla decided to retire out of the blue. Apparently he got a very minor injury, was moved out of the majors, and then decided to retire despite the injury being less than a week in length.

If this is supposed to go under Bugs, please move

http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll95/sloatc4/ugglaretired.jpg?t=1209707177

[ohms_law]

11.10 Active players retiring [Fixed 11.11] (http://forum.sportsmogul.com/showthread.php?t=174628&highlight=retire)

The fix will be generally available after the next official patch is released.

[NattyOs8]

his back was bruised... i don't blame him...

[Coreno]

his back was bruised... i don't blame him...

severely.




which begs the question, why is he out lesa than a week with a severely bruised back.

[Coreno]

i also notice in the background that 3 other players retired just 2 days earlier.

[Waldo2186]

11.10 Active players retiring [Fixed 11.11] (http://forum.sportsmogul.com/showthread.php?t=174628&highlight=retire)

The fix will be generally available after the next official patch is released.

I'm running version 11.13.

[bwburke94]

A nice way for Clay to solve this is: AI teams shouldn't move injured players to the minors, only the DL, where they must spend at least 15 days. And maybe players on the DL should never retire.

[HoustonGM]

A nice way for Clay to solve this is: AI teams shouldn't move injured players to the minors, only the DL, where they must spend at least 15 days.
Agree with this.


And maybe players on the DL should never retire.
Don't agree with this. What about a 42 year old who goes down for 12 months?

[dolfanar]

A nice way for Clay to solve this is: AI teams shouldn't move injured players to the minors, only the DL, where they must spend at least 15 days. And maybe players on the DL should never retire.

Except the DL is IN the minors.

I've been saying this for 2 years now... this needs to change. NOW.

And short term injuries shouldn't be sorted AT ALL. Leave them in their spot in the lineup, let the bench fill in... EXACTLY what we do as players.

[HoustonGM]

Except the DL is IN the minors.

I've been saying this for 2 years now... this needs to change. NOW.

And short term injuries shouldn't be sorted AT ALL. Leave them in their spot in the lineup, let the bench fill in..
Yep. A 15/60 day DL would be a fantastic addition...


EXACTLY what we do as players.
Exactly what some of us do as players to preserve realism ;)

[JustinM]

And short term injuries shouldn't be sorted AT ALL. Leave them in their spot in the lineup, let the bench fill in... EXACTLY what we do as players.

Eh, I take the time to move them to the bench, but then I play every game, so I want the predictability.

[CSteelPA13]

Kind of on a similar topic, but without the retirement problem...I don't know if this has been mentioned either, but there seems to be days when a starting pitcher gets an injury and is out for 5, 10, and sometimes 15+ days...yet he gets injured 2 days AFTER he pitched...meaning, two days had gone by and two more pitchers had pitched after him, yet he gets injured doing nothing later in the week. I know this had been an issue in years past as well, but I thought it was taken care of...

[HoustonGM]

Kind of on a similar topic, but without the retirement problem...I don't know if this has been mentioned either, but there seems to be days when a starting pitcher gets an injury and is out for 5, 10, and sometimes 15+ days...yet he gets injured 2 days AFTER he pitched...meaning, two days had gone by and two more pitchers had pitched after him, yet he gets injured doing nothing later in the week. I know this had been an issue in years past as well, but I thought it was taken care of...
It's not really an "issue" so to speal...Mogul doesn't have in-game injuries. When ptichers get injured on off-days, I just pretend something that's totally realistic - the pitcher tweaked something during his last start, and a couple days later, you know the extent of it...or, it's also entirely realistic for pitchers to hurt themselves on off-days during bullpen sessions or warm-ups...or in the case of mike hampton, during pre-game warmups1

[CSteelPA13]

It's not really an "issue" so to speal...Mogul doesn't have in-game injuries. When ptichers get injured on off-days, I just pretend something that's totally realistic - the pitcher tweaked something during his last start, and a couple days later, you know the extent of it...or, it's also entirely realistic for pitchers to hurt themselves on off-days during bullpen sessions or warm-ups...or in the case of mike hampton, during pre-game warmups1

Well, Mike Hampton is a mess...but that aside, I had thought of those scenarios, but they don't happen as often in real life as they do in BM09...I suppose I'll take that as a valid answer anyway, haha.

[HoustonGM]

How often do pitchers come out of a game with an injury and immediately go on the DL after the game? Usually, it takes a few days before the DL announcement comes out..

[CSteelPA13]

Well I'm in July 2011, and I've had a starter miss 11 days, another miss 15 days, and a third starter has missed 15 and 24 games at two different times. It happened in 2010 too, with two of my pitchers missing a combined 60 games(give or take a few)...all of which happened 2 or 3 days after they had last pitched.

[HoustonGM]

Well, I'm saying in real life. Most pitchers get placed on the DL on days that they didn't pitch..

[CSteelPA13]

Well, I'm saying in real life. Most pitchers get placed on the DL on days that they didn't pitch..

True, but usually the unjury is at least known of the day of or the next day...even if BM has no in game injuries, you'd think it would at least show up the next day or right after the game was done.

[HoustonGM]

True, but usually the unjury is at least known of the day of or the next day...even if BM has no in game injuries, you'd think it would at least show up the next day or right after the game was done.
Mogul's injury system isn't really sophisticated. For example, players can't play through injuries, so, really, it's just something that's easily understandable right now until the injury system is redone

[TGwynn]

I waited a year to purchase this mogul which is nice, but I still believe the retirement system in this game is a little ridiculous. I enjoy creating a roster that includes numerous rookies and accurate minor league veterans. I also like to attempt to mimic the present major league baseball season. Unfortunately, even with all teams human the computer still retires players (on average nearly 50 in the first two months). I have simulated with commissioner mode on and off. People have argued that players retire midseason all the time. That is correct, but they also come back and play as well. This game has no ability to do so.

I would like to see you be able to control retirements on your own and leave it out of the computers hand. And yes I know about the retire button, but in the old versions players only retired at the end of the season for the following reasons: AGE and if the free agent pool was to small.

Is there any way, I can do this. Otherwise, this game is useless if you have to recreate players that retire in this game and in real life keep coming back. Such as a button that talks players out of retirement.

Is there a way in the game you can limit the retirement of players.

[HoustonGM]

So uh...

2009. Yovani Gallardo, age 23. Went 14-4 with a 3.68 ERA in 2008. Pitched 2 games in 2009, 0-2, 5.91 ERA. Got a strained chest - out 4 days.

He retired.


That is ENTIRELY premature. Something needs to be checked out in the retirement code.

[TGwynn]

Again, nothing ever gets done with this.

I started mentioning this two years ago and it continually worsens. There are so many other things in this game that could be aided, yet we had to tinker with mid season retirements. This game flowed when retirements were solely at the end of the season and were geared to old players.

You look across MLB and yes players retire, but typically they are few and far between. The rosters I am playing with have over 50 players retiring in the first two months of the season and by the end 144 players. An additional 109 players retired after the season. And that is not even including players that did not have any major league experience that do not show up in the retirement log. Completely unrealistic. And that is with all teams being controlled by human rather than computer.


The free agent pool drops off the face of the earth. A simple solution would enlarge the free agent pool or leave retirements up to the controller of the game.

An actual response would be nice with solution to this issue versus, oh were working on it.

Secondly, more time has been spent on this versus having the option for a 12 man staff versus the standard 11 which it is extremely rare to see in the Major league today.

[TGwynn]

Assuming that we are working to make the game mirror reality.

[HoustonGM]

It's not true that nothing ever gets done. Clay tweaked the retirement AI as recently as 11.10/11.11. It just needs more work.

[Honus]

How often do pitchers come out of a game with an injury and immediately go on the DL after the game? Usually, it takes a few days before the DL announcement comes out..

And often the placement is retroactive, so effectively they went on the DL list immediately--or on whatever arbitrary date is selected (I suppose there are rules somewhere that govern this).

[EVEN11323]

Bump for 11.25. Just had a 22 yr old Corey Patterson retire.

[ohms_law]

So?

[EVEN11323]

You don't think there is anything werid about a guy who had a 72/91 rating @ 22 years old retiring?

EDIT: Didn't mention prior rating in 1st post, sorry about that.

[Fish Troll]

The rating says 57. :-/

[HoustonGM]

The rating says 57. :-/
Because he's retired.

[ohms_law]

EDIT: Didn't mention prior rating in 1st post, sorry about that.

Which is why I asked...
;)

Regardless, he likely retired because of the injury (being put on the DL). Where was he before becoming injured and retiring? R, A, AA, AAA?

[HoustonGM]

Which is why I asked...
;)

Regardless, he likely retired because of the injury (being put on the DL). Where was he before becoming injured and retiring? R, A, AA, AAA?
Even so, a 2 day injury of a prospect resulting in a retirement is something that needs to be looked at. That shouldn't happen.

[EVEN11323]

He was on the MLB roster and played April 2-4, and then retired. On a side note, his retirement left the Cubs with 0 natural CFers.

[ohms_law]

Yup, that explains it. The DL is technically in the minors, so the player AI saw that he was being demoted and so he retired.

[HoustonGM]

Yup, that explains it. The DL is technically in the minors, so the player AI saw that he was being demoted and so he retired.
Yeah, I thought this issue had been taken care of....guess not.

[ohms_law]

If I remember correctly it was reduced, not eliminated... I'm fairly sure that I remember that it was specifically reduced for veterans, as well.