ERA Error.......

[Slugger222]

Dateline....
Fast Sim 46
August 3, 2002
Pittsburgh vs Atlanta

John Thompson is charged with 0 earned runs for this inning:

Warren Morris walked.
Pat Meares reached first on a fielding error by the shortstop.
Javy Lopez allowed a passed ball.
Leo Palewicz walked.
Omar Olivares walked.
Jose Valentin hit an infield single to first, scoring a run.
Aramis Ramirez hit an infield single to third, scoring a run.
Bubba Trammell struck out.
Tony Clark homered over the right field fence for a grand slam.
Ray Lankford flied out to right.
Warren Morris struck out.
6 runs, 3 hits, 2 errors, and 0 left on base.
At the end of the second, Pittsburgh leads 6 to 1.

All of the runs should have been earned.

[TGG]

Pat Meares reached first on a fielding error by the shortstop.


Any runs the come a cross the plate will be UNEARNED. The pitcher is never "punished" for fielders mistakes.

This is from the baseball rule book : ( kinda long)

EARNED RUNS
10.18
An earned run is a run for which the pitcher is held accountable. In determining earned runs, the inning should be reconstructed without the errors (which include catcher's interference) and passed balls, and the benefit of the doubt should always be given to the pitcher in determining which bases would have been reached by errorless play. For the purpose of determining earned runs, an intentional base on balls, regardless of the circumstances, shall be construed in exactly the same manner as any other base on balls. (a) An earned run shall be charged every time a runner reaches home base by the aid of safe hits, sacrifice bunts, a sacrifice fly, stolen bases, putouts, fielder's choices, bases on balls, hit batters, balks or wild pitches (including a wild pitch on third strike which permits a batter to reach first base) before fielding chances have been offered to put out the offensive team. For the purpose of this rule, a defensive interference penalty shall be construed as a fielding chance. (1) A wild pitch is solely the pitcher's fault, and contributes to an earned run just as a base on balls or a balk. (b) No run shall be earned when scored by a runner who reaches first base (1) on a hit or otherwise after his time at bat is prolonged by a muffed foul fly; (2) because of interference or obstruction or (3) because of any fielding error. (c) No run shall be earned when scored by a runner whose life is prolonged by an error, if such runner would have been put out by errorless play. (d) No run shall be earned when the runner's advance is aided by an error, a passed ball, or defensive interference or obstruction, if the scorer judges that the run would not have scored without the aid of such misplay. (e) An error by a pitcher is treated exactly the same as an error by any other fielder in computing earned runs. (f) Whenever a fielding error occurs, the pitcher shall be given the benefit of the doubt in determining to which bases any runners would have advanced had the fielding of the defensive team been errorless. (g) When pitchers are changed during an inning, the relief pitcher shall not be charged with any run (earned or unearned) scored by a runner who was on base at the time he entered the game, nor for runs scored by any runner who reaches base on a fielder's choice which puts out a runner left on base by the preceding pitcher. br /> NOTE: It is the intent of this rule to charge each pitcher with the number of runners he put on base, rather than with the individual runners. When a pitcher puts runners on base, and is relieved, he shall be charged with all runs subsequently scored up to and including the number of runners he left on base when he left the game, unless such runners are put out without action by the batter, i.e., caught stealing, picked off base, or called out for interference when a batter runner does not reach first base on the play. EXCEPTION: see example 7. EXAMPLES: (1) P1 walks A and is relieved by P2. B grounds out, sending A to second. C flies out. D singles, scoring A. Charge run to P1. (2) P1 walks A and is relieved by P2. B forces A at second. C grounds out, sending B to second. D singles, scoring B. Charge run to P1. (3) P1 walks A and is relieved by P2. B singles, sending A to third. C grounds to short, and A is out at home, B going to second. D flies out. E singles, scoring B. Charge run to P1. (4) P1 walks A and is relieved by P2. B walks. C flies out. A is picked off second. D doubles, scoring B from first. Charge run to P2. (5) P1 walks A and is relieved by P2. P2 walks B and is relieved by P3. C forces A at third. D forces B at third. E hits home run, scoring three runs. Charge one run to P1; one run to P2, one run to P3. (6) P1 walks A, and is relieved by P2, P2 walks B. C singles, filling the bases. D forces A at home. E singles, scoring B and C. Charge one run to P1 and one run to P2. (7) P1 walks A, and is relieved by P2. P2 allows B to single, but A is out trying for third. B takes second on the throw. C singles, scoring B. Charge run to P2. (h) A relief pitcher shall not be held accountable when the first batter to whom he pitches reaches first base on four called balls if such batter has a decided advantage in the ball and strike count when pitchers are changed. (1) If, when pitchers are changed, the count is 2 balls, no strike, 2 balls, 1 strike, 3 balls, no strike, 3 balls, 1 strike, 3 balls, 2 strikes, and the batter gets a base on balls, charge that batter and the base on balls to the preceding pitcher, not to the relief pitcher. (2) Any other action by such batter, such as reaching base on a hit, an error, a fielder's choice, a force out, or being touched by a pitched ball, shall cause such a batter to be charged to the relief pitcher. NOTE: The provisions of 10.18 (h) (2) shall not be construed as affecting or conflicting with the provisions of 10.18 (g). (3) If, when pitchers are changed, the count is 2 balls, 2 strikes, 1 ball, 2 strikes, 1 ball, 1 strike, 1 ball, no strike, no ball, 2 strikes, no ball, 1 strike, charge that batter and his actions to the relief pitcher. (i) When pitchers are changed during an inning, the relief pitcher shall not have the benefit of previous chances for outs not accepted in determining earned runs. NOTE: It is the intent of this rule to charge relief pitchers with earned runs for which they are solely responsible. In some instances, runs charged as earned against the relief pitcher can be charged as unearned against the team. EXAMPLES: (1) With two out, P1 walks A. B reaches base on an error. P2 relieves P1. C hits home run, scoring three runs. Charge two unearned runs to P1, one earned run to P2. (2) With two out, P1 walks A and B and is relieved by P2. C reaches base on an error. D hits home run, scoring four runs. Charge two unearned runs to P1, two unearned runs to P2. (3) With none out, P1 walks A. B reaches base on an error. P2 relieves P1. C hits home run, scoring three runs. D and E strike out. F reaches base on an error. G hits home run, scoring two runs. Charge two runs, one earned, to P1. Charge three runs, one earned, to P2.

[dougummel]

Yikes, I hope you didn't just type all that TGG. If you don't have anything to do, give me a call.....I've got some work for you!

:D

Thanks for the clarification, though. It was something I had always wondered.

[TGG]

Nope, cut & paste is the only way to go..........

This is the site to check out : (http://www.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/mlb/baseball_basics/mlb_basics_foreward.jsp)


Hmmmmmm now as for work.......... I could use some of that :)
lol

[Slugger222]

In determining earned runs, the inning should be reconstructed without the errors (which include catcher's interference) and passed balls,

But that only accounts for Pat Meares. Although the PB is considered an error, it was an error which allowed a man who had reached on an error to advance a base.

Only Pat Meares should have been un-earned.

5 Earned Runs - 1 Earned Run.

[Slugger222]

There was another ERA discrepancy.......

Sammy Sosa walked.
Eric Chavez grounded to second.
Joe Mays threw a wild pitch.
The Brave Hearts brought the infield in.
Julio Zuleta singled in the right field gap, scoring a run.
Brook Fordyce struck out.
Julio Zuleta stole second.
Edgar Renteria was intentionally walked.
Mike Sirotka singled to right, scoring a run.
Adam Hyzdu homered over the left field fence for three RBIs.
Fernando Vina singled down the right field line.
Kevin Sefcik popped up to second.
5 runs, 4 hits, 1 error, and 1 left on base.
At the end of the second, St. Louis leads 5 to 0.

All of the runs are earned, (the error was a WP, and the pitchers are responsible for WPs) but Joe Mays was credited with 0 earned runs.

[Slugger222]

It looks like the Sim considers any runs scored after an error as unearned.

If that is the case, it will probably take a fair amount of re-programming to correct that. As you've seen by the rule, the rules for ERA are pretty complex.

[Slugger222]

Another incorect figuring of Earned Runs....

Andy Ashby was charged with only one earned run for this inning



John Vander Wal grounded to third.
Wilton Veras doubled in the right field gap.
Mike Lamb doubled down the left field line, scoring a run.
****Andy Ashby threw a wild pitch.****
The Rebuildings brought the infield in.
Michael Barrett was intentionally walked.
The Rebuildings brought the infield in.
Jeff Weaver lined out to center.
*****Andy Ashby threw a wild pitch - a run scored.*****
Juan Encarnacion singled down the left field line, scoring a run.
Chad Allen homered over the center field fence for two RBIs.
*****Kevin Young reached first on a fielding error by the second baseman.*****
Raul Mondesi doubled in the right field gap.
John Vander Wal struck out.
5 runs, 5 hits, 3 errors, and 2 left on base.
In the middle of the second, Pittsburgh leads 5 to 0.

Although wild pitches are considered errors, the pitcher is responsible for them, and therefore any runs scoring as a result of, or after a WP are earned.

All of the runs in that inning are earned. The only runners who could be have been considered un-earned were Kevin Young and Raul Mondesi, and neither scored.

Sorry for the long post.......

[kingjames]

Actually, in the first example, both Morris and Meares would have been unearned runs.

Warren Morris walked.
Pat Meares reached first on a fielding error by the shortstop.

Not only did Meares reach on the error, Morris must have advanced as well.

[ogallala]

what I find interesting about the first example is that the score should have been 7 to 1 not 6 to 1 :

1 Morris walks
2 Mears to first on error
3 Palewicz walks .... the bases are now loaded
4 Olivares walks .... thats run #1 and bases still loaded
5 Valintin single, one run scores ... thats run #2 bases still loaded
6 Ramirez single, run scores ... thats run #3 bases still loaded
7 Clark grand slam home run ... 4 more runs for a total of 7

someone vanished on the base paths